tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post4133006491935091099..comments2024-03-28T10:18:00.370-05:00Comments on Gentlemen of Leisure: Game of Thrones 4x06: The Laws of Gods and MenAustin Gortonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14281239771248780430noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post-10047055910959621772014-05-18T01:16:49.522-05:002014-05-18T01:16:49.522-05:00@Sarah: "Especially since those dragons are g...@Sarah: "Especially since those dragons are going to keep eating"<br /><br />I really don't mind the 3x the price if this was a one time thing. But Dannerys should really figure out how to feed her dragons without impacting other people.<br /><br />"was not a literal "i want the throne" and was instead a "i want power""<br /><br />Yeah, in the end, that's how I took it. Now the question is why he wants to be pulling the strings. Is it for the altruistic reasons he has espoused or is it for more selfish reasons?<br /><br />"Also, i totally want one of those cylinders of coins."<br /><br />They were cool, but the almost seemed too modern to me.<br /><br />@Austin: " I dunno, stab *him* before he releases the hounds?"<br /><br />But...he's a main character!<br /><br />"Basically, Oberyn is the new Tyrion as far as Westeros government is concerned."<br /><br />Yeah, but Tywin seems more tolerant of his behavior than Tyrion's. Probably for the obvious reasons.<br /><br />"I don't actually think anything that was said was an outright lie"<br /><br />As you said, I think Pycelle was lying. And I was probably lumping Shea's testimony in with that statement too.<br /><br />"Unless, of course, it turns out she's been on Tywin's payroll, so to speak, all this time, a longer and more elaborate version of the whole "tried to marry a whore who was only paid to love him" episode from Tyrion's youth."<br /><br />That would be interesting but that doesn't seem to be Tywin's style. Like he cares about Tyrion's happiness.<br /><br />@SpaceSquid: "What if Great Master is a title that doesn't require you to own slaves?"<br /><br />I would think if he didn't own slaves that's what Hizadahr zo Loraq would have lead off with. But I'm with you, it is interesting to think of all the implications.<br /><br />In the end, I'm not going to feel sorry for slave owners being crucified. At the same time, I don't think it was the best decision by Dannerys. You can't beat equality into people. You need to change their entire outlook on the issue which, obviously, is a tall order. But by crucifying the masters you're drawing a line in the sand. You're separating people instead of bringing them together.<br /><br />@Blam: "Tywin, at least, should be smarter than that."<br /><br />I would think. It's like saying, "an atomic bomb has never one a war before" before WWII. It's true...but only because they hadn't existed yet.<br /><br />"You-all found the necklace. The dwarf ain't that reckless!"<br /><br />Nice! I was trying to come up with a joke along those lines.Dr. Bitzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13568570859981368717noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post-70230251903249554082014-05-17T00:16:14.604-05:002014-05-17T00:16:14.604-05:00Why did Yara just stand there facing a barely arme...<br>Why did Yara just stand there facing a barely armed, bare-torso'd Ramsay, waiting for him to let those dogs out of their cages? I'm pretty sure there were archers with her. Also, I know that the whole rescue attempt was probably a necessary plot point, on the face of it as well as how it set up this next scheme of Ramsay's, but seeing Yara and her men get right back in their boats with nothing to show for the escapade felt like a complete narrative waste of time.<br /><br />I'm with you about Tywin's and Cersei's reactions to Daenerys' armies, dragons, and general conqueritude. Tywin, at least, should be smarter than that.<br /><br />Shea is apparently just stupid, although the fact that she didn't get what Tyrion was doing in pushing her away was at least set up by her jealousy and feelings of inferiority (not in terms of actual [self-]worth, perhaps, but station) regarding Sansa.<br /><br /><i>// Unfortunately Tyrion doesn't have Johnny Cochran to represent him. //</i><br /><br />"You-all found the necklace. The dwarf ain't that reckless!"<br /><br /><i>// So when sailing underneath the giant soldier statue straddling the waterway into Braavos, what do you see when you look up? //</i><br /><br />If the sculptors were feckless, he's probably schmeckless.<br /><br>Blamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07342343767763035991noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post-46272109833706976772014-05-16T07:15:49.968-05:002014-05-16T07:15:49.968-05:00So when sailing underneath the giant soldier statu...<i>So when sailing underneath the giant soldier statue straddling the waterway into Braavos, what do you see when you look up?</i><br /><br />According to the books, it's a manned defensive emplacement, and you see people staring down at you, which sounds like something guaranteed to make its way into your darkest and most Freudian nightmares.<br /><br />@Sarah Ahiers<br /><br /><i>I find it interesting that the Lannisters always pay their debts, except, i guess, when it come to financial debts? </i><br /><br />Ah, but therein lies the rub. The Lannisters always pay their debts (though I'm not sure they necessarily do so promptly), but Tommen is nominally a Baratheon, and when the Iron Bank lent money to the first Baratheon to sit the Iron Throne he pissed it away like he was a riot hose and the King's Landing whores were peaceful protestors. I've no doubt Tywin has told the Iron Bank he'll be paying them on an instalment plan now he's back in charge (and indeed we know from last episode that he intends to do that using Tyrell gold), but Davos' whole point here is that statistically Tywin won't live for all that much longer (even if he weren't a major player in a political game that's seen one Hand and four kings dead in the last three seasons), and Tommen himself can't be trusted.<br /><br />Which is a nice irony on the story's part: the best way to reassure the Iron Bank would be to appeal to the historical fiduciary trustworthiness of a House they cannot admit Tommen fully belongs to.<br /><br /><i>Also, really Dany? 3x the worth of his goats? Just pay him the worth and some extra for time lost. Or maaaaybe 1.5 or 2x. But 3x? What's the point of that? Especially since those dragons are going to keep eating, which means they will keep decimating flocks, and you've now set a precendence. Dumb.</i><br /><br />I had that same thought, though of course as Queen she can revoke a precedent any time she chooses. But yes, I see a lot of conveniently burned sheep in the next few weeks.<br /><br />(Which rather reminds me of this, actually:<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66SQKEf7UIs<br />)<br /><br />@ Teebore <br /><br /><i>Part me wonders if maybe Varys has some kind of plan in motion to prevent Tyrion's death, like secreting him away before an execution, and was just playing his part publically.</i><br /><br />Well, we know he <i>could</i> do it, from his appearances in Ned's cell back in Season 1. The question is whether doing so would be of any benefit to whatever plans he has (which after three and a half seasons we still can't adequately describe beyond a) helping out the Targaryens and b) dicking over Littefinger), or if not, whether his professed gratitude from the end of Season 2 will come into play.<br /><br /><i>Yeah. It's like the antebellum slave owners that tried to take the moral high ground by saying they treated their slaves well. </i><br /><br />I loved this scene, because so many conflicting things come out of it. So yeah, he was one of the better Great Masters, but he was still part of the ruling class of a slave power. He's clearly guilty by association. But does owning slaves necessarily warrant crucifixion? What about if he'd been working to reform Meereen? What if Great Master is a title that doesn't require you to own slaves? How far does a man have to divorce himself from his slave state before his guilt is significantly lessened? Is it better to give up and move elsewhere in protest, or are you obligated to remain where you are and try to use your power to effect change? Was this guy a George Washington, or an Abraham Lincoln? And even if we had more info, how much can we believe the testimony of his own son anyway?SpaceSquidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09760939592584995876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post-89001712082735040512014-05-14T12:42:17.831-05:002014-05-14T12:42:17.831-05:00So when sailing underneath the giant soldier statu...<i>So when sailing underneath the giant soldier statue straddling the waterway into Braavos, what do you see when you look up?</i><br /><br />Junk 'n' stuff. Also, I had the same thought. <br /><br /><i>Why was Ramsay Snow covered in blood when he showed up to the cells? </i><br /><br />I took it that he had fought his way past some of Yara's men that she had stationed along the way to/outside the kennels.<br /><br /><i>but his father still owned slaves. So congrats on him only being mostly evil?</i><br /><br />Yeah. It's like the antebellum slave owners that tried to take the moral high ground by saying they treated their slaves well. <br /><br /><i>And if a dragon could win a war back then, why couldn't it now?</i><br /><br />Also, I think Tywin is underestimating how big Dany's dragons are, because dragons got progressively smaller as they neared extinction. They aren't as big as the original dragons, but they're pretty big, and still growing. I could easily see them razing King's Landing if Dany is able to train them up. <br /><br /><i>Something seems off about Varys seemingly wanting to be king.</i><br /><br />Like Sarah, I took his glance less to mean he wanted the actual crown/throne, and more just that he wants to control it, be the power behind the throne, so to speak. <br /><br /><i>If she really took everything Tyrion had said at face value then that really makes her look stupid.</i><br /><br />It does, and the impression I got was that she was so hurt by Tyrion's "be mean to get her to leave and save her life" routine that now she's all "eff him, let him die", which is indeed stupid. Unless, of course, it turns out she's been on Tywin's payroll, so to speak, all this time, a longer and more elaborate version of the whole "tried to marry a whore who was only paid to love him" episode from Tyrion's youth. <br /><br /> Austin Gortonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14281239771248780430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post-15841632901779678082014-05-14T12:35:59.333-05:002014-05-14T12:35:59.333-05:00I will say that there isn't a bath house fille...<i>I will say that there isn't a bath house filled with naked women near my bank.</i><br /><br />You're going to the wrong bank, my friend. <br /><br /><i>Soon enough, Ramsay shows up and really kicks some ass because he’s the boss of this level. </i><br /><br />Ha! Yeah, that scene really didn't do much for me. For one, I felt like the hounds shouldn't be *that* much of a threat. I mean, stab them? And since Ramsey was the only one left standing of his guys by the end, I dunno, stab *him* before he releases the hounds? <br /><br />My brother said that whole "Yara tries to rescue Theon, then gives up when she sees he's Reek" was fabricated for the show, which probably explains why it's so insular and ultimately pointless. <br /><br /><i>Oberyn, meanwhile, is leaning back and with his leg on the table showing off how cool and casual he’s taking all this.</i><br /><br />I also liked that he didn't rise when Tywin entered, which echoed Tyrion's whole "slowly drag a chair across the room" bit in a previous Small Council meeting. Basically, Oberyn is the new Tyrion as far as Westeros government is concerned. <br /><br /><i> Instead Tyrion just has to sit and listen to witness after witness give half-truths or outright lie.</i><br /><br />I don't actually think anything that was said was an outright lie - except, I suppose, Pycelle claiming Tyrion stole his poisons, which is just Pycelle slinging shit - just lots of half truths or full truths that lacked context (like what Joffrey was having done to Sansa when Tyrion threatended Meryn Trout), which I thought was a nice bit of writing (and emphasizes your point about the uselessness of a trial without cross examination). <br /><br /><i>Varys pretty much gives a non-answer.</i><br /><br />That was curious. Part me wonders if maybe Varys has some kind of plan in motion to prevent Tyrion's death, like secreting him away before an execution, and was just playing his part publically. Then again, maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part because I kinda like Varys and he was the only one who seemed to appreciate what Tyrion did for the city in season two, and I'd hate for all that to have been a lie. <br /><br /><i>No way this plan could go awry, right?</i><br /><br />I appreciated that Tyrion pointed out how Ned was basically given the same deal on paper, and look how that turned out. <br /><br />Also, it seemed pretty obvious from his quick acceptance of Jaime's offer that Tywin had been manipulating events since the murder to get to that outcome. Like, whether he believes Tyrion or not, he's leading the prosecution against him because he wants Jaime to reclaim his inheritance. <br /><br />Austin Gortonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14281239771248780430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7266470995513648978.post-24299190728198203512014-05-14T10:47:13.037-05:002014-05-14T10:47:13.037-05:00I find it interesting that the Lannisters always p...I find it interesting that the Lannisters always pay their debts, except, i guess, when it come to financial debts? <br /><br />I know Ramysay was rewarding Reek, but when you spent a lot of time dehumanizing him so he becomes your brainwashed slave, a humanizing bath seems a risky move to take, especially when it's clear that he's still sort of in there, based on his reaction to being told about Rob's death.<br /><br />Also, really Dany? 3x the worth of his goats? Just pay him the worth and some extra for time lost. Or maaaaybe 1.5 or 2x. But 3x? What's the point of that? Especially since those dragons are going to keep eating, which means they will keep decimating flocks, and you've now set a precendence. Dumb.<br /><br />There's no way Varys could ever achieve that throne. He's not noble and he's a eunuch. He has to know this, too, so it made me think that his blatant look at the throne was not a literal "i want the throne" and was instead a "i want power", which does fit in with his character.<br /><br />The Shea stuff also didn't make sense to me. Yes, he hurt you, but did he hurt you so bad that you want to see him executed, but also, before that, shamed and emasculated too? I don't know. That just didn't fit in with Shea's character thus far and her clear love for Tyrion. <br /><br />Also, i totally want one of those cylinders of coins. They were awesomeSarah Ahiershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02795455714801965956noreply@blogger.com